Facing KM-Problems using macOS HighSierra 10.13.6

Maybe, you're right and that could help me ... but what Version should that be ?? Remembering when I bought KM the Version was 9.0 - and I never had issues with KM since that Day.
Before I began rebuilding my Macro Collection I tried using Version 9.0.2 to 9.0.5 and what I can say is that every Version causes me the same Issues I was reporting earlier.

No lucky at all, believe me :blush:.

16-MB RAM is 8-MB beyond the spec for that model. It can't address more than 8-GB. That could be the issue. Try taking an 8-GB stick out so you have just 8-GB and see if things don't settle down.

I do have a 13-inch MacBook Pro of the same vintage ( (8,1) with 16-GB Ram and a smaller spinner hard disk in it that also has no problems at all running Keyboard Maestro.

So I suspect your problem isn't Keyboard Maestro itself. It's just the bearer of bad news.

Before I write me nuts just take a look at some Screenshots I made from my Mac Specs a few minutes ago...

Bildschirmfoto 2020-07-11 um 01.53.35 Bildschirmfoto 2020-07-11 um 01.53.09

Here you are ... I am sorry to say that but in my Opinion there are no Hardware issues addressing my Ram-Kit.

I think all you're proving is that the chips themselves are good. The Mac won't address all that space. See MacBook Pro (17-Inch, Mid 2010) at Crucial. Only 8-GB.

Maybe you are right when it comes to that MacBook Pro model. but I am using the MBP 7.1 13" Model. - and yes, Apple sold it with max 8GB Ram but it works with some 3rd party RAMs like the 16 GB - Kit from the Hardware Seller MacSales.com

I had no Issues working with 16GB since day 1. It is a lot faster and I have no issues running from time to time more than 12 UI Apps at the same time.... so there is no issue addressing so much ram either.

I really doubt that KM 9.05 is the cause of the issue here, but one can't really diagnose a general problem statement. It is good background to have, but we need specifics to work with.

So I'd suggest this:

  1. It is most likely due to HS permissions, security, and/or accessibility issues. So start with a careful review of this, even though it is not HS specific:
  2. Pick the macro which most consistently fails/crashes and provide us with details:
    1. upload your macro
    2. Detailed steps to reproduce the problem
    3. Screenshot when it crashes
    4. If KM crashes, then be sure to complete the KM crash report.
    5. KM Engine Log entries when it fails. Maybe this macro will help:
    • If the macro won't run, maybe you can use one of the scripts to export the KM log

Finally, may I ask why you can't upgrade to Mojave?
I've been running Mojave for over a year now with no issues.

P.S. The above macro may help, maybe it is simpler if I just give you the AppleScript to export the last 100 lines from the KM Engine log:

property ptyScriptName : "Open Last N KM Log Lines in BBEdit"
property ptyScriptVer : "1.0"
property ptyScriptDate : "2020-05-24"
property ptyScriptAuthor : "JMichaelTX"

set numLogLines to "100"

set cmdStr to "tail -r -n " & numLogLines & " ~/\"Library/Logs/Keyboard Maestro/Engine.log\""
set logListStr to do shell script cmdStr

tell application "BBEdit"
  set oDoc to make new text window with properties {contents:logListStr}
  tell oDoc to select insertion point before its text
end tell

You can run this script from Script Editor or Script Debugger.
It creates a new document in BBEdit.
Save that document, zip it, and upload to forum.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes.

If you have a crash (or freeze), report it to support, and include the crash report (or Activity Monitor sample).

Crash reports are in the ~/Library/Logs/DiagnosticReports folder.

You can get to ~/Library (which is in your Home folder, but generally hidden from you) in the Finder by holding down the shift (or option) key and selecting Library from the Go menu in the Finder.

Peter, many apps I'm familiar with bring up a "Crash Report" for the user to fill in the next time the app is opened after a crash. Does KM do this?

Yes, it asks to send the report to us automatically.

But i get very few crash reports these days, and no recent ones from 10.13. So often it can be that "crash" means something different to technically crashing.

That's good to know.
I did not know because KM has never crashed on me. :+1:

First of all, thank you for your suggestions @JMichaelTX .
I´ll try to give my very best to give you all that Information you´re asking for. I will just take some time.

What I can tell you for now is that my MBP 7.1 is NOT in Apples List of Supported Devices for macOS 10.14 Mojave or later.
Maybe I could use the unofficial "Mojave Patcher" from the Developer called "dosdude1" only with dark mode settings (because of NO METAL Graphics Support) - but I don't know if it won't cause any issues either. For now that my MBP 7.1 is my One and only Mac I can work with I would not try doing this.

For your other suggestions I´ll come back later.

Many thanks that you all try to help me in such a short amount of time.

Thank you @peternlewis - already know this I have some Hazelrules working for me to copy every new ".crash - File" whatever Application it is from and backup to a Dropbox Folder with reporting about that via Notification.

Sorry to say that but that is one example I can report about - KM should ask me every Time when I am reopening it after a crash. But it DOESN´T DO THAT on my Mac. Even Asking for sending a Report to Apple is NOT working that way either. I don't know why but that is the Fact I can tell you about.
Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I don't have set it to send Diagnostics and/or Reports to Apple automatically - but that is totally crap to me. It should work - EVERY TIME ....

Here is the last and only one zipped ".crash - File" form KM I could find for the last 2 or maybe 3 months???!

Keyboard Maestro_2020-07-03-182823_Kurtys-MacBook-Pro.crash.zip (23,1 KB)

On that day if I can remember it right it was also the last time I were asked from my Device to send Report to Apple. I Took a copy of the displayed Text and send it manually to support.

I am really sorry to give you such bad news to work with @peternlewis.

Greetings from Germany

Keyboard Maestro scans the ~/Library/Logs/DiagnosticReports when the editor launches looking for reports that start with “Keyboard Maestro” and end with “.crash”. Do such files exist?

I have in fact received that crash report, although it does not have an email address associated with it - check your Keyboard Maestro General preferences and see if it is set to Always send your diagnostic reports.

I also have four others over the last four months from you with the same crash issue.

That crash report is pretty easy to read in broad terms:

Thread 0 Crashed:: Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread
0   libobjc.A.dylib               	0x00007fff595dde9d objc_msgSend + 29
1   com.stairways.keyboardmaestro.editor	0x0000000100d3f0dc NewScrollWheel(NSScrollView*, objc_selector*, NSEvent*) + 221
2   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
3   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f9da368 -[NSView scrollWheel:] + 359
4   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
5   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
6   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f9da368 -[NSView scrollWheel:] + 359
7   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
8   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
9   com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f9da368 -[NSView scrollWheel:] + 359
10  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
11  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f9da368 -[NSView scrollWheel:] + 359
12  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f8f056f forwardMethod + 211
13  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f9da368 -[NSView scrollWheel:] + 359
14  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff300bc43d -[NSWindow(NSEventRouting) _reallySendEvent:isDelayedEvent:] + 5040
15  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff300bac70 -[NSWindow(NSEventRouting) sendEvent:] + 497
16  com.stairways.keyboardmaestro.editor	0x0000000100d903a0 -[IntegratedWindow sendEvent:] + 142
17  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2ff1c0d6 -[NSApplication(NSEvent) sendEvent:] + 2110
18  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f77c87d -[NSApplication run] + 812
19  com.apple.AppKit              	0x00007fff2f74ba3a NSApplicationMain + 804
20  com.stairways.keyboardmaestro.editor	0x0000000100b2e3db main + 155
21  libdyld.dylib                 	0x00007fff5a206015 start + 1

Basically it is crashing in response to the system going nuts with the scroll wheel processing. Other than your five reports, I have about 20 others over the last 12 months (probably since the release of version 9) (so two crashes per month total on average). Reports are not limited to 10.13, but happen on other versions of OS X as well.

If you can determine exactly when using the scroll wheel crashes, in a reproducible way, that would definitely help narrow down the cause.

But this only explains five editor crashes in about as many months - not something I'm happy about, but far less than what you are describing in terms of problems.

It doesn't indicate any crashing creating macros (unless you just mean crashing in the editor generally when using the scroll wheel).

And this would not have anything to do with “macros are not executed but aborted”, and I don't know what you mean by “macros like KMFAM cannot be installed”.

“But maybe one more thing: I have to do a SMC reset at least 2-3 times a day because KM causes problems.”

I don't even know what that means - what on earth would require an SMC reset? And how is it related to Keyboard Maestro? Resetting your SMS should be a last resort - I don't know that I have ever done it myself, I can't recall ever suggesting it as a good idea for anyone.

You say “the list of enumerations is long” - but a) you need to solve one at a time, they are not all related, and b) without enumerating them they cannot be solved.

There are thousands of people running Keyboard Maestro 9.x still on 10.13, and I get no stream of reports of issues, so problems in general should be either rare, or specific to particular situations.

As far as this crash goes, if you can narrow down the cause, which is related to processing a scroll wheel event and probably depends on exactly what is shown or exactly what the mouse is over at the time, then I can look in to it further (and I will do my own investigation as well to see if I can figure it out).

As far as everything else, you need to deal with one specific problem at a time, there is not likely to be any kind of systemic issue.


Yes, there is one File at this Path just because of my Clean Install a couple days ago. It is the same „.crash -File“ that I have uploaded recently.

No, it is set to ask for sending diagnosting reports.

Bildschirmfoto 2020-07-12 um 11.12.02

Thank you for translation into human like language what is going on with KM. It is good to know that I am not alone with that issue....

Of course I can .... It happens when I am working on one of my Palette-Trigger-Macros for use with BetterTouchTool and an AppleScript in Finder and maybe in Path Finder, too.
This is the Macro for now ...

Since that there are so much different File-Extensions whose I want to trigger a Context based Pallette for, it is growing. I began to group them all into different categories - and so I am using one "Switch/Case-Action" for each category so that it is easier for me to edit that "Monster".
My goal for this macro is that I have to remember only one Gesture and/or Command for every Input - Device I want to use with it.

Bildschirmfoto 2020-07-12 um 13.03.51

Just some Palettes to show what my Macro above is for. If I had set up some Palettes of these I would. show that as screenshot, too - but that is not the thing.
For now it is should be a good reference for you to work with. It is just one of many possibilities to show where that "scroll wheel processing" is crashing.

This shot is showing what I was talking about grouping the expected FileExtensions into categories.

Macro Part

Yes you´re right ... just five .... I just can tell you what issues I have ... and to prevent that - I am not a Person who is writing bullshit...

Here is another short example what drives me nuts - my little "Toggle Edit Mode - Macro" for KM. It is a very simple one and should be running every time because it has no complex modification.

That's one of a few other ones I can tell that they will be aborted.

Okay ... maybe you don't use that very great macro but @JMichaelTX should even know wich Macro I am talking about. it is the KMFAM Favourite Macros and Actions Set created by @DanThomas. It gets a timeout a few seconds after opening the Script-based Installer Application while choosing the Path for the Resource Files.

I am a everyday-User of this Macro and I had no issues before.

For now it should give you some information to work with. Maybe I can come back later for more Info if you need more.

Greetings from Germany

Thanks for showing the image of your Macros -- that definitely helps.
However, to really diagnose the issue we need the Macro file as well.
Can you please upload your macro ?

The important thing is likely to be where the mouse is when you are using the scroll wheel. Can you explicitly cause the crash?

When you say “aborted”, what do you mean?

What does the Engine.log file say when it is aborted?

No, I don't use it. I'm afraid I don't know anything about its installer application or how it works, so I can't help you with this one.

Yes for now I´ll post ist here.
But since I am planning on another Post with a detailed Explanation and Documentation of this Macro for Improving and/or sharing I am going to replace this with my dedicated post later. I am saying that because there is something related to this "Monster" I maybe need help with. So please comeback to possible mistakes in context of this macro later when I made the Post for it or feel free to send me a Direct Message. There you can ask me all questions you have about it whats not related to this Topic here.

The linked Macro should be imported in a Group named "NEW MACROS [DEV]" That is my Group for developing new Macros.

Show Contextual Palette based on File-Extension.kmmacros (604,0 KB)

My preferred way using the scroll wheel is mostly in a "center-like" Position relative to the width of the Macro Area of the Editor - maybe sometimes my mouse is more on the left or on the right.

It just doesn't occur - the Macro is in a Group named "Keyboard Maestro {Group}" which is only active in KM and also is like a "Funktion Library" For Macros related to the Editor it self whether it is triggered by "Hot Key" or a "Trigger-Macro" on a Palette.

So for the moment the Macro can only be triggered when the Editor is at front ....

For now I don't know .... It seems that is was working today ... but I don't want to play with the devil ...
I´ll try to look at the Engine.log file if there is something bad about the Macro to find...
I will report later about that...

That is just okay .... Like I thought about it. Will post about that issue in the dedicated Topic. Maybe the others there can help me with that....

For macros that "do nothing", you need to figure out whether the macro triggers and the actions fail to do anything, or the macro does not trigger, and for the latter, whether it is because the macro group is inactive or for other reasons.

The Interactive Help, Something expected is not happening, is designed to help determine the cause.